Diversifying your board – yup, it’s time for that awkward convo! But it’s so key for representing your community, getting new perspectives, and just making decisions with more empathy and cultural awareness. Am I right?
In this episode, I chat with Andy and Mayowa from the National Science and Technology Medals Foundation about how they transitioned their board from pale and male 👴👴 to a diverse dream team! 🙌
Here are some nuggets of wisdom gleaned from our discussion: :
- To effectively diversify, you have to look beyond surface diversity to passion and abilities.
- Relationship building is clutch! Take time to connect with potential recruits before they join. Steward each member intentionally even after they’ve joined.
- Give diverse members multiple ways to add value, not just cutting checks. Offer options like volunteering, social media, and building networks.
- Lend recruiting support by doing prep work like LinkedIn searches and email templates. Meet them where they’re at!
- Foster connections between members through fun social events outside meetings. Personal bonds help teams work together.
“Set the aspirational goal of what you want the board to look like in
terms of representation … diversity … skill set… [G]o for that. It’s going to get frustrating but it’s a worthy exercise.” – Andy Rathmann-Noonan
“Some people really do not come from a place where there’s generational wealth, but they have something to offer “ -Mayowa Awe
It may get uncomfortable, and it will definitely take time and patience; but, diversifying your board will uplevel the impact and effectiveness of your org!
Check out the episode for more practical insights on how you can diversify your board and have capacity while achieving the mission and vision of your NPO.
Important Links:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/andy-rathmann-noonan-69081053/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/mayowaawe/https://nationalmedals.org/
Episode Transcript
RHEA 0:00
Welcome to Nonprofit Lowdown. I’m your host, Rhea Wong.
Hey podcast listeners, Rhea Wong with you once again with Nonprofit Lowdown.
So today I’m talking about a hot topic that everyone wants to know about, diversifying your board. Today, my guests are Andy Rathmann Noonan and Mayowa Awe. Andy is the president of the National Science and Technology Metals Foundation, and Mayowa is the senior director of InSTEM. Welcome both of you to the show.
MAYOWA 0:36
Thank you. It’s great to be here.
RHEA 3:07
Oh, this is going to be fun. Before we just jump into the deep end on this particular topic, Andy, what does the organization do?
ANDY 0:44
The National Science and Technology Medals Foundation is a 501c3 public charity located in Washington, D.
C. Its mission is to build a more diverse, inclusive, and equitable STEM community. That mission was newly adopted by the board unanimously in 2020. And so the key flagship program of that Mission is the in stem program, which my way here is the senior director of in stem is a four year mentorship program that keys in on the intervention point at undergrad in an effort to retain diverse talent from underrepresented groups.
Instead majors. It’s focused. The program itself is focused on holistic wellness power skill development, et cetera. I won’t talk too much because I would I’m sure Maya has some thoughts on what the program is. But in general, that’s what we do and that’s who we are and that’s our identity.
The other, the sort of secondary part of our organization is we were, when we originally founded in 1990 it was around celebrating the work and lives of the laureates of the National Medal of Science and National Medal of Technology and Innovation. Those are presidential medals given out by the President of the United States.
We’d love to see it happen every year, but as you can guess, the presidential schedule is quite unpredictable. In the time where the last. Medals laureates were honored in 2016. We ourselves have changed dramatically. And in 2020, of course, we adopted the mission and launched a program in STEM that allowed us to redefine who we were in terms of our positive impact on the STEM community.
RHEA 2:07
Mayowa, I’d love to talk to you because you are a woman of color in STEM. I’m just wondering how did this mission resonate with your personal experience?
MAYOWA 2:17
I remember when I was coming on to the organization, one of the things that I spoke with Andy about is that the mission of the organization very much embodies what I naturally do.
And so I’m very big on education. I’m very big on being an advocate for groups that may not be able to advocate for themselves at whatever time. So I’m very big on advocating for groups and making sure that. People have what they need to succeed. And so having gone through some of these lived experiences that some of the students that we serve have been through, I’m able to, identify what it is that our students need to be successful.
RHEA 2:54
Since you’ve transitioned the mission, how did you look at that through the lens of who was serving on your board?
ANDY 2:59
We as an organization are firm believers and everything that we do we are working towards making stem equitable.
And what equity means in the context of making sure that all people are welcome and empowered to be successful in stem. And so when I think about when we thought about that from a sort of holistic view of the organization to be Thank you. Perfectly critical, like our board was quite homogenous in 2016.
When I joined 10 years ago, every single board member, except for 1 was a white male older white male. And that was after a significant when we went from 22 board members to six board members. So , in 2016 when we realized maybe that the Laureates of the Medal of Science and Medal of Tech weren’t going to be announced anytime soon, we had to ask some really tough questions about Who we were as an organization when that was our primary mission.
And what we realized through a set of listening sessions called an evening with, which has now been rebranded to the unscripted series. We took laureates and other STEM leaders to undergraduate campuses and got a lot of feedback that the undergraduate experience was falling short of their expectations, especially if it was a student from an underrepresented group studying STEM.
As an organization, we had to make sure that in everything we did at the board level at the organization level was representative of those core components of equity and representative of the diversity and inclusion we sought to create within the community. So we went out and started to think about, okay, let’s Recruit a board that can be represented to the diversity of this country.
Both from a viewpoint, a background experience and let’s go out and build that board. It in the likeness of what our organization’s mission talks about.
RHEA 4:34
I think the.
Maybe inherent tension that a lot of people might think is we can either have a board that has capacity or we can have a board that is diverse, but we can’t have both. And so I’m wondering if you could speak to that. Is that actually attention? Or is that an imaginary attention that we make up in order to maybe not do as much work as we can to diversify?
MAYOWA 4:56
I would say that it takes time to have both. You can absolutely have both. That’s not a thing. You can have both. I think where the problem comes in is what the definition of diversity for an organization is. And a lot of times people will solely focus on the racial and gender diversity, but there are different facets that we need Can use to define diversity.
People may use diversity is like a crux and like a checkbox. We want to make sure that we have a diverse board. And okay, we’ll have 1 woman of color check that checks the box and we’ll keep it moving. However, that is very disrespectful to. Those diverse candidates because they do have much more to offer.
And it takes one looking past just the initial, like the physical, or, the category that this person checks and looking more into what is it that this person can bring because they have lots to offer, they have connections they know the things, they have experiences that can be beneficial and then figuring out how to use that within your organization.
You can have it takes time to identify these people that are able to both help you build your capacity and also help expand diversity within the organization.
RHEA 6:05
When you say it takes time can you walk us through the specific steps? Cause I, 2016 to 2023 today, your board looks very different. You have a much more representation, both in terms of race and gender and, other things that are not obviously visible from your website, for folks listening and they’re like, Andy, Mayowa, I’m down.
Word, but what does it take when you say it takes time? What does that look like? What’s one of the first steps that we can take here?
ANDY 6:31
There’s practicing intentionality in terms of who you go out and recruit and defining sort of the ideal profile of the board member you want to recruit. And also, again, to my was point like this is not a checking the box exercise. This is about recruiting a potential board member from a back an ideal candidate background that you’ve defined and I’ll go into how we defined it in just a second.
But then it’s also building that relationship with that board member understanding before you even talk about them and join the board, understanding their interest level, understanding. Where they are most excited about from a potential of the mission of the organization to what they’re more, they have more reluctance or aren’t as well versed in terms of a skill set and really building that relationship going forward.
One relationship building is a good exercise, it’s worth doing, regardless of whether it ends with some possible candidate for the board relationship building is an effective exercise and effective use of your time. Number two. Going in before you do the recruitment process. I think it’s important to do an audit of your board.
Meaning build a matrix. Define your columns as the categorical needs of the organization, legal, accounting, development, fundraising program management, those are just a few to name a few and then put your board members on the left hand side and then start to really.
Do some analysis of what can each board member do? What kind of skillsets do they have, both in terms of their corporate experience or organizational experience, where they might be working currently, as well as their experience, maybe on other boards and nonprofits. And just in general, your interactions with them in terms of their skillsets around specific, your specific categorical needs.
And from there, you’re going to be able to get a really good understanding of where your gaps are. In terms of skill board skillset, and that will help actually build that ideal profile for who you want to recruit next now, in terms of recruiting with this concept, this really important concept of diversity, equity, inclusion in the forefront.
I think it’s important. You go out and you identify, look, I think we need to build a board that’s inclusive. So let’s go out and build a board that’s inclusive, whatever that looks like, bring in the stakeholders, bring in your board members. As you start to recruit board members, start to get a list of names, talk to the staff.
One of the exercises that Mayo and I did was if you wanted to go recruit a board member, who would you go recruit? And then we worked through recruiting that board member. So the prep work is almost as important, which is identifying the gaps in the current board in terms of skillset and ability.
Building the ideal profile with those gaps in mind. And then again, going out and recruiting the most diverse best board you can recruit and being strictly adherent to that goal has helped me tremendously because I don’t have to compromise. I can uphold that principle and still work towards that broader goal, that representation, that general representation and the social and moral imperative of being diverse, inclusive and equitable really in general and everything that we do.
MAYOWA 9:13
And I will say that as far as timeline, it could take up to a year to get one candidate, right? You have to start that relationship very early. And be patient and be okay with the fact that, okay, I may not get this one candidate until a year’s time because you want them to want to engage with current board members engage with your programming in some way.
You need to make sure that this candidate is very well informed of what their roles and responsibilities will be, what your organization is about, and whether they feel like the culture of your board is something that they are comfortable with.
RHEA 9:46
That’s really helpful, and I couldn’t agree more that you have to approach this with intentionality.
My question and Either of you can answer this as well is around the change management aspect, because, if your board is, as I say, pale and male, and you’re making this very significant pivot to a new mission, a new sort of focus area, how do you manage that? Because, obviously as well these are folks that you want to continue to have a relationship if you can, who have been important to the organization, who may also have, contributed to the capacity and the resources are like, what. What does that look like in a way that, is as elegant as it can be?
MAYOWA 10:26
Part of it is one having those very intentional, very it’s sometimes uncomfortable conversations with those male and pale type members of your board. And I think something that’s also very helpful is having some type of training so that there’s that common, language that we can all go from to one understand the importance of this initiative what it really means and how, those members of the group may be able to contribute to it.
It’s having those conversations and also having trainings.
ANDY 10:57
I couldn’t agree more. I think 1 of the things that I learned quickly and the hard way was when we really started to go out and say let’s build the board that we can be proud of, and that serves our mission, is the change management I had a very short term view of let’s go build that board and then how that board helps impact the organization will be defined by how effectively we, as an organization can deliver a program or deliver the instant program for that matter.
And I think that was nearsighted of me. And that’s something that I think it didn’t make us take steps backwards, but it did put a little bit more pressure on the programmatic delivery that I realized going forward that that didn’t necessarily have as much impact in terms of the board level culture in the way that was intended.
I think the training is really helpful. The onboarding process and the sort of clarity and transparency of the needs of the organization in those conversations is really important. And to have that conversation early on is really good. I think 1 thing that’s interesting about our organization is that.
Because we adopted a new mission in 2020. There’s a number of board members who joined the board prior to 2020 that are pretty familiar with who we were. And then there’s a number of board members who have joined after 2020 that are more familiar with who we are now, and melding what could be very different.
Organizations. That is also a change management process that has taken longer than I think I anticipated, but it’s worthy of continuing to make steps towards the board fully buying into it as well as all understanding the common language through a really substantive onboarding process that could help make sure everyone at least at a base level, have a really good understanding of our DEI values and what we’re trying to do as an organization from the mission perspective.
RHEA 12:36
What would you have done differently? Cause I know folks are listening to this. I’m in this process. I want to know what are the things I should be aware of?
ANDY 12:43
Yeah, I think two things. One is. We didn’t have any training for the onboarding process. So implementing training number 1 to Maya’s point, I think it’s a great one. Number 2 don’t assume that when you’ve made the ask to join the board and they’ve accepted that your relationship building effort with that individual board member is done.
That’s an ongoing process. And I think that there have been times and missed opportunities where I. Didn’t prioritize the stewardship of each individual board member to get full buy in at the mission level. And I think that going forward that attention to each individual board member stewardship, rather than assuming that they understand what’s going on in a bit more intentional in terms of engaging on a one on one basis where.
We’re checking in. Where are you on this? How do you feel about this? And what are your thoughts? What are your feedback? And over communicate in that manner, especially with the new board members.
RHEA 13:37
Mayowa, back to you. So I know you, mentioned that you joined the organization. About two, two years and six months, according to LinkedIn, right? And that was at the beginning of this new mission and this new focus. How much of that did you know coming in and how much have you been a part of , being the change as it were?
MAYOWA 13:57
I knew coming in like part of the process of bringing me in, and it was learning about the history of the organization. And so I knew where the foundation was prior to me joining, and I knew where we were going. Now, the program that I was brought on to to lead to direct. Was very much like the flagship program that would lead us towards that mission.
And so I was very integral in making sure that we’re essentially walking the walk when it comes to building an equitable and inclusive stem communities. And by touching base with board members at board presentations or board meetings and having presentations where I’m actually showing, the impact that we’re having the students that we’re able to touch through the work that we’re doing.
I think that. Helped board members to be excited about the work that we’re doing. It showed them essentially, like the tangible realization of all of the hard work that they’re putting in as board members. And so I think this program itself, the program is very integral to changing that mind frame and shifting both for new and old or continuing board members, shifting that frame of mind for the foundation.
RHEA 15:10
Actually, let me back up here because I realized I just jumped in without enough context. Maya, can you give us a sense of what does your board look like today with respect to diversity, equity, and inclusion?
MAYOWA 15:20
So we have people from all over really all over the nation as well as, the various gender identities, we have a good mix of racial identity also within the board.
And our board actually has experiences that differ. I would say that each board member has something that they’re bringing in. And for example, somebody that’s in the education space, somebody that’s in, the defense space, but something that’s adjacent to STEM, STEM education policy type deal.
And so that’s what the board looks like. And so it’s made up of people that are able to speak to these various pieces.
RHEA 15:55
I want to talk about sourcing. Can you talk? Around the strategy of where to find the people and the sourcing and being really intentional about that. So I’m, I don’t know if you had folks in your network that you were able to connect to, because I’m just thinking about all of the things that folks say I just don’t know where to find these people.
ANDY 16:13
We just started with a list. We did the audit of the board and where we were with skill set gaps and whatnot, or just like needs foundational needs.
And then we started to just build a list, both from Previous donors who have given significantly in the past or have been significant amplifiers of our content or of our work friend, people we have relationships with that also have the means or checkup or would help fill gaps within the organization.
And then also we had the reaches, it’s almost and I hate to reference this because Second, higher ed right now with the affirmative action ruling is so out of whack, but it’s like your reach school, your good fit school and your safety school. And what’s your reach board member who would be the epic person from your perspective, even though you’ve never met them before.
Just in terms of on spec who would be the epic. And then let’s talk about how we could get in contact with this person. Get board members to weigh in. You have a couple of names in mind, people that could help. Deliver on some of the needs of the organization. And you build that list.
And then from there, it’s so I got my start as a recruiter as a finance and accounting recruiter. So I have, the cold email, cold phone call thing is something that like. I, I have to continue to do and it’s something that I don’t really mind. LinkedIn is a really good platform.
It’s been really effective. I think it’s it’s also gotten better. I think honestly, over the years it’s it’s a really good place to do a an initial sort of primary vet of someone’s background. And get an understanding of where they’ve been and what they’re bringing.
And then their LinkedIn message or a warm referral. So if you know someone who knows someone, then make that connection. And that’s where the starts are. And then from there, you try and start to have a conversation, but it is a numbers game. Make the biggest list. You can make the biggest list you can, and then start to work through and maybe tier and rank those individuals.
In terms of, a set of. Evaluation standards, whether it’s skill set, whether it’s ability to get in contact with them, whether it’s, reach or good fit and then go forth and try to really see how many people you can get engaged. Because at the end of the day, it serves to report.
There’s a number of different purposes. It can serve you in terms of board recruitment, but it can serve you in terms of getting people to get to know your organization. So it’s again, like I said, it’s a, it’s an exercise worth doing because it’ll either lead to a possible board candidate.
But in general, it’ll just breed to general awareness about your organization.
MAYOWA 18:30
Now, I’ll say for me within my network, I’m in professional organizations. and so within those organizations, there are people that one can reach out to to, for board recruitment. Professional organizations are 1 and then people within my personal network are those that I could reach out to.
I would also say for us, specifically in the type of work that we’re doing working with undergraduate students, looking at those institutions and looking at. One alumni from those institutions, because they will be very invested in the work that you’re doing to try to help future alumni of their institutions.
And so you start there, right? And you look to see who is involved in similar programming at those schools and try to get connections that way. And that will 1 lead to potential board members who are very much sold into the mission of your organization already. And then you can have further conversations about what else is needed.
RHEA 19:23
That’s really helpful. Am I correct in assuming that your board is both personally giving and engaged with fundraising and opening networks and so forth?
Yeah, you can, that’s a fair assumption for sure. Okay,
cool. So one of the things that I’m wondering about is, sometimes with diverse board members, I think there’s perhaps a reluctance to ask them to both give at a certain level of capacity and or open their networks based on the generational wealth gaps.
And then I think on top of that, Folks of color may not necessarily be as conversant with capital P philanthropy in the way that we practice it in this country. , how are you helping to steward and coach your board members regardless of their background into being engaged with fundraising?
ANDY 20:13
Yeah, great question. That’s something that we’re working on, every day. So in terms of right now, we’ve expanded what it means not expanded. We have a very broad definition of what it means to be a, an impact impactful board member, right? There’s sweat equity, there’s Social media amplification.
There’s personal contributions. There’s door openings to potential leads. There’s corporate match campaigns. There’s advocacy within their particular organization on behalf of the N. S. T. M. F. To give small contributions out of your paycheck, in terms of corporate giving, and all of those things are valuable.
They’re across the board. Extremely valuable program. Program assessment and management is extremely valuable in terms of our ability to deliver a program. That’s going to have impact on its key constituencies being able to write a personal check. Incredibly valuable being able to open doors.
Incredibly valuable. One of the challenges we have as an organization is that are given periods pyramids inverted. We have our highest concentration of donors are the 5 above and above category. And so we have a much
Yes, exactly. So we we want to. So what we want to do is make sure that 1, Board members can actually key in on helping build out that lower part of the pyramid, because that’s an engine, and helping build programs where they feel comfortable in that space.
So it’s not a five figure, ten figure, five figure, six figure ask or conversation, it’s a three figure, two figure ask. And we use existing programs like Giving Tuesday or setting up another Giving Day in the calendar year to help create space for there to be a momentum around that sort of small gift size ask.
Not too much lift and really keep that momentum going. The positive momentum behind that. But also like never downplaying the value of. Non check related power, right? Like the value of having a board member who is deeply invested in sort of the program delivery of in stem or deeply invested in, say, the social media strategy of the organization.
Those are also incredibly valuable because they can make a huge difference in terms of what is an instance scholar saying about the organization? What are their testimonials look like? What are their surveys look like? And then how does that survey affect your donors perception of the program? And then on the social media side, for example, is like a validation.
Oh, wow. They put out really great content. This strategy is cohesive. I’m seeing it here and here in the manner that I need to see it. And it’s sticking to me as a donor or a potential donor for the organization. So I think it’s important when it comes to fundraising, being clear on board members can have value in multitudes like there’s a multiple ways of board member can have value and impact on the organization and really working with each individual board member to identify where their value impact resides. That is going to be hugely important and then from the fundraising side, just making space for there to be growth in terms of.
Small start, very small, 50, a hundred dollars. Do a Facebook campaign. Do a LinkedIn post. Those are the types of things that we can really start to build upon going forward from a affecting both our giving pyramid number one, but also just in terms of putting board members in a position where they’re comfortable and can be successful, which again, we’ll read more moment.
MAYOWA 23:29
I will say when I joined the foundation, I found that strategy was very interesting to me. And I think makes sense just providing options providing various options for fundraising. Some things will that aren’t direct checks from a person. Will inevitably convert into a direct check from somebody from a potential donor.
And for example 1 of the things that I’m very interested in doing for the program for the instant program is somehow publishing, right? Having some type of scientific publication that really shows the impact that the program is having. Now, if a board member is able to assist and maybe that data analysis portion of such a study.
That and the paper gets published that in itself, the fact that it in a sense of validates program or shows the impact that the program is having will lead to potential donors. 1 understanding what this program is doing, and then being more confident when it comes to donating for the program.
I’m not sure if that makes sense, but. It’s this idea of just providing this array of options, because, like you mentioned, some people really do not come from a place where there’s generational wealth, but they have something to offer and as a foundation, we make important to support people. For example, there have been times that we’ve sat with board members and said, okay, who do you know?
Who do you think that you can reach out to on behalf of this foundation? And we will help in writing this cold email. If you don’t feel like you have the lingo, so we provide, email wording, we provide like 1 pages, whatever it is that specific board member needs in order to help us fundraise we provide.
And so I think that really should be something that organizations prioritize is not just. Hey, give me a check here and there, but like, how can I support you in doing that? And maybe you’re not in a position to provide a direct check, but what are other avenues in which you can indirectly result in somebody giving us towards our
RHEA 25:30
And I just want to double click on something Andy said about the power of LinkedIn. So using LinkedIn as a tool and a filter, there’s literally a little check box that says, I would be interested in joining a board when you do the advanced search, but also to your point, Maya, what about. You helping board members to understand the constellation of their universe, right?
Because I think sometimes it’s who do you know is a hard question. But if you can use LinkedIn and be like, here are the 10 people in your network that I think could be interesting, it gives us a starting place, right? Don’t make your board members do the work. You do the work. And help them to help you.
Since you brought it up, Andy, I want to talk about affirmative action for a 2nd. So I imagine that 1 of the ways in which it’s really helpful to have a racially diverse board is that there are folks who have 1st hand lived experiences with higher ed and affirmative action. And I’m so just. I guess I’m just wondering from a programmatic standpoint, from an organizational standpoint, like what have the conversations been at the board level relative to your organization and where you sit in this whole conversation?
ANDY 26:37
I am both male and pale. So affirmative action was not a program that was eligible to me, clearly. But affirmative action is an integral program that the striking down of was an abomination. Personally it also the ruling itself was. Astronomically as nine now, the conversations that are happening at the board level is 1. Because of our position as an organization, as a nonprofit that works in undergrad works with undergraduate students, we have a unique perspective on this.
We are hearing firsthand what the undergraduate experience is like for students who may have been eligible for affirmative action, as well as the opportunity to convene discussions about the impact Of that ruling on well, in our particular case, the stem landscape that being said, so the board members are interested in having convening conversations beginning a series where we’re having virtual seminars about it bringing in authorities that will help provide guidance on how to perhaps maneuver around the ruling.
One of the benefits of working as a nonprofit is that. When we provide a grant, which is the way the incentive program gets this funding at the institution actually serves as a shield against. Accusations from our perspective of racial preference when it comes to programming options and programming access.
So we also have an opportunity to continue the mission that has been sequestered by the ruling as well as make sure that, the thing is the STEM community will be in a in a detrimental way, will be negatively affected by this ruling because The STEM community is still a a small exclusive group of very much the same looking group of people.
And so the gatekeeping that’s going on, the, who, you know, not the, what, and the stripping away of what should be a meritocracy is not a meritocracy at all. And I think that’s the statement that can be made about our society in general. That’s a little bit of a bully pulpit. What I would say is the conversations that are going on is that we’re one, every board member is.
Very well in tune with that ruling. And they’re very well in tune with making sure that we are becoming a information source for how to overcome that ruling. And that is something that has become an important component of what we’re going to try and do in the fall, as well as going forward, continuing to advocate for equity inclusion within STEM and continue to advocate for the importance of retaining diverse talent in STEM in undergrad, even though there has been legislation and policy making it much harder to do
MAYOWA 28:57
I would say at least personally, it’s more of a, it’s feel to continue doing what we’re doing and to continue to do it harder and to find ways to support our students through this because our students are going to have to maneuver, this and we all, it’s going to be detrimental, but in what ways and how exactly and to what extent we don’t truly know yet. And as things continue to unfold, just making sure that we are at the forefront of these conversations both, keeping in touch with the students that we serve as well as whatever is going on politically.
We’ll continue to have those conversations so that we stay ahead of this. And I firmly believe that as a foundation, we are really uniquely positioned to continue to support our students and essentially Be part of the solution to this like it in my mind. I’m like moving to the side.
We’ll continue doing what we’re doing And because we’re a non profit I think like we’re protected in some way To do that. So it just makes our work much more crucial
RHEA 29:59
if there is a silver lining to this horrible cloud is I once heard someone say I never let a good crisis pass like It’s important to have work that our board members feel very, connected to, committed to, in front of them and so look, this is a horrible thing, horrible ruling, wish it didn’t happen.
And maybe the silver lining here is it really has fired up the board to be engaged in a really important issue. And the other thing that I just really want to underscore here is regardless of what you’re doing with your board engage them in really interesting questions, engage them in important issues, right?
Because so often I think we come to the board and we’re like, here’s the report, blah, blah, blah, like rubber stamp it, see you in a quarter, right? But how can we really galvanize and use them as the resources that they are in the organization?
It seems to me that when you are. Recruiting diverse board members, there needs to be more intentionality around how you bring them together.
I was associated with 1 board and basically it was a very homogenous board. They all hung out together. They all went to the same golf club together. They all went to the same parties together. So it, it felt like when you got into the board meeting, there was that social cohesion already.
Yeah. I’m wondering if you could speak about some intentional things that you’ve done in order to build the relationship between board members, especially board members that, may not in their normal day to day lives have the opportunity to be in in community together.
ANDY 31:27
It’s something we’re still working on. So I don’t have all the answers, and I don’t think anyone expected me to or any for that matter, but I think let’s not downplay the effect that COVID had and the ability to gather in person with a board that set spread across the country zoom meetings and zoom burnout were very real and adding 1 more meeting to an agenda or a schedule of an already busy board meeting board member to meet with another board member wasn’t going to happen. Now that we seem to be in a space where gathering in person is safer. Now what I’ve the conversations I’ve been having with board members is like.
Autonomy, take agency feel free contact that individual. You wanna get coffee with a fellow board member, by all means go do it and send us the receipt. Like it’s opening up the doors again of this interaction can happen between board members and there. It doesn’t have to be a surrogate.
One of the things that, the way that the organization was run prior to about 2021 was. The quarterly board meetings were an hour. They were hyper efficient. They went, there was an assumption that there was a, that, that board members all read the sort of briefing packet. And then there was a run through of the business of the board.
Highly efficient is great. I think that the board was looking for more of a let’s brainstorm. Let’s interact. Let’s create some dynamic deliverables. Let’s let’s come up with some new ideas. And I think what we’re working on in terms of change management, there is 1, our board meetings are no longer an hour.
They’re about an hour and a half now. There’s a lot of discussion time that’s blocked off. And then going forward, there’s been a continuous sort of Advocacy for please reach out to a board member. If you have a specific question, the thing I’ve always said to board members over the last few weeks about this is my ideal is that you all meet together independent of me.
I don’t know about it. And you come back to me with a set of questions about the organization, about the programming, about the fundraising needs, because it shows that you have all gotten together and started maybe working or talking about the problem. Maybe you’re offering some different perspectives.
That is like an ideal outcome. In terms of like the tactics there. And again, this is something that we’re doing right now. And it seems to have paid off a little bit in the short term, but that’s what we’re employing right now in terms of trying to get that cohesion there because
we don’t have that cohesion at the board right now. For a lot of contributing factors, but we’d like to get there.
MAYOWA 33:33
In board meetings we’ll notice at times they’re super passionate about whatever one topic is. And so we’d say, okay, let’s set a meeting up so that, you two, or you three can talk about this.
And it may be people that, don’t interact outside of the board meeting. And so we help them convene these meetings. And then in those meetings, we as Andy and Maya do not have to be in the meetings and so making that initial touch point with board members after noticing what it is that they’re super passionate about within the meetings has been very helpful and I also want to, hone in on that in person gathering and it doesn’t have to be like in person board meetings, right?
It could be Opportunities where board members are able to engage with our programming. For example, next week, we have an in stem summit in D. C. that we’re hosting and so inviting board members to interact with each other as well as interact with the students in our program. And really just a very casual manner can help with that cohesion and allow them to really just be authentic.
This is not a formal board meeting. Let’s all go out, after maybe in the evening and play bowling, for example, and so putting them in situations that are very casual can help board members that may not connect outside of board meetings or may not connect, themselves to get to know each other.
RHEA 34:46
I think really creating that container for that social cohesion is so important because at the end of the day, we can look at the research around belonging and teams. But if people don’t know or trust each other, it’s going to be very hard for them to work together. Last thoughts here, zooming out.
Is there anything that we haven’t yet covered that you think is imperative for folks, as they think about diversifying their board?
ANDY 35:10
Be aspirational in terms of the board set the aspirational goal of what you want the board to look like, in terms of representation, in terms of diversity, in terms of skill set and go for that. And it’s going to get frustrating, but it’s a worthy exercise because of the 25, 30 outreach points you, you make LinkedIn cold email introductions, et cetera. You’re going to get a relationship out of at least one of them, whether that leads to a board member is one thing or another, but really the most important thing is there’s a relationship there that you’ve now built. Relationship building is a muscle, but set the standard of expectation and be aspirational in terms of your board.
It sounds super cliche, but go find superstars. You’ve got a great mission. You’ve got a great program. Go find the superstars that are going to be the board that you believe is going to affect the most change from a positive position.
I think that is something that is, is extremely important that I would say, I say over and over again to myself. It’s don’t compromise. Yeah. Just go out, go out and recruit the best board you can possibly recruit and continue that conversation.
RHEA 36:09
Wait, on that note, Mayo, I want you to have the last word here, but I’ve recently become very obsessed with 10X is easier than 2X by Dan Sullivan.
And so now everything I’m doing, I’m putting through the lens of is this a 10X activity or is this a 2X activity? Is this a 10X word member or is this a 2X word member, right? And so if you’re constantly using that as a filter, you’ll make decisions based on a future that you are aspiring to versus the future that you inherited by accident.
MAYOWA 36:35
I would also say to get current board members involved in the conversation as far as it comes to diversifying your board. You do really need the people that are there. Currently, you need their buy in. You need to all come to a common understanding of what is needed. Where are the holes?
Where are the gaps? And in this conversation of diversity and inclusion within a board has to be at the core. And so how do we define these terms right as an organization? And how are we holding ourselves accountable? What are the metrics that we’re using? To make sure that we are on track.
And in addition to that, just really understanding, like we mentioned at the beginning that it takes time. And so give yourself grace, right? It could take a year, like I mentioned. To get that one person that you are aspiring to have on your board but definitely be gracious to oneself and get your current board members involved in the process.
RHEA 37:24
Thank you, Maya. Absolutely. I say it all the time. It took me like six years to finally get the board that I wanted. So it is a slow process of, as I say, loving them out the door and bringing in new people that you want. So friends, this has been really great. Thank you so much for your advice, your expertise, your experience.
We’ll make sure to put your information in the show notes if folks want to get in touch with you. And if you’ve enjoyed this podcast, please consider giving this a review on Apple podcasts or wherever you listen and share with a friend. So Andy, Mayowa, thanks for being on the show. Thank you. Thank you so much.
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